Foreign Minister Stubb: “This is my thing”

By Kari Huhta
     
      Finnish Minister for Foreign Affairs Alexander Stubb (Nat. Coalition Party) is an idealist. He says so right at the beginning of the interview, answering a question on what he believes in.
      “If I need to be pigeon-holed somewhere, then how about an international liberal? My fundamental values are simple: democracy, human rights, equality, freedom. That’s where it begins. It is community thinking centred around the individual.”
      “I believe in the basic goodness of humanity. Someone will call this idealism, but a healthy dose of idealism is needed in this line of work.”
     
Stubb has been Finland’s Foreign Minister for a year and a half.
      He has implemented a policy line that is more clearly west-oriented than that of any of his predecessors.
      His work is dominated by crises such as the one in Afghanistan, as well as other wars, in which the goodness of humanity is not the most apparent characteristic.
     
On his first visit to the Middle East, Stubb declared himself to be an optimist. In August he declared the date that the war between Georgia and Russia broke out (080808) to be a turning point in world politics.
      He does not admit to regretting either one of these somewhat stretched out statements, although he says that during his time as Foreign Minister he has learned to think twice before making any.
      “Perhaps 080808 was a greater turning point in international politics than I dared imagine. It wasn’t the kind that I thought it would be. It was very important for the EU. It spurred on partnership with the east, the strategies concerning Central Asia, and the new strategy with Russia. It was then followed by the financial crisis, which had some kind of effect, and by the election of Barack Obama as the President of the United States. So the change was not so terrible after all.”
      Stubb describes his foreign policy thinking in a serious, manner, somewhat in the tone of a lecturer. His answers emphasise a faith in a strong Europe and strong structures.
      “Like Jean Monnet himself, I believe in strong institutions, but in these days it is easy to take a slightly lighter formula and score some quick victories by agreeing on things which ultimately have nobody to implement them.
     
Stubb frequently mentions Monnet, one of the architects of European integration.
      He goes through the process in which the international system moved away from the bipolar status of the Cold War, in which the United States and the Soviet union were pitted against each other, to the unipolar condition in which the United States was dominant, and from that to the present day.
      “Now is the third phase, which actually started with the election of Obama. The movement is toward a multipolar world, where the nation-state takes on a strong position, something like it did in the 19th century. There is a kind of great power thinking that predominates.”
     
It doesn’t sound like a particularly stable or ideal system - at least not according to the political thinkers that Stubb sees as his role models (Aristotle, Plato, John Locke and Montesquieu).
      The cut-and-dry institutions and rules that Stubb appreciates face challenges. Replacing them are improvised assemblies, such as the G20 group of old and emerging economic powers, which have risen to a place of prominence thanks to the economic crisis.
     
“Although I am an institutionalist and an idealist, I am also a realist. I analyse international politics on a temporal level, and now we have a model emerging that involves light multipolarity.”
      “In my own G-world, the best place for a small country like Finland is that if there is a G2 group emerging around China and the United States, which is very possible, then there should also be a third, the EU, which would turn it into the G3.”
      Stubb will not predict the future of the new system. The significance of the UN is being put to the test at the Copenhagen climate conference in December. The greatest challenge for the United States and the EU is Afghanistan.
     
The position of the United States remains strong. “Perhaps the role of the United States in relation to its previous role is weakening, but in general, the starting point for international politics is what the policy line of the United States is. International politics is also a question of atmosphere, and the United States creates it, through its president.”
      “If one dares look into a crystal ball, it could well be that in 50 years China will be the world’s largest state economically, militarily, and demographically - a real superpower.”
     
Russia is a more difficult case to predict, but in respect to that country, Stubb feels that the EU has a special role. He goes through an assessment of his ministry, according to which the Russian economy is a cause for concern, and its foreign policy is contradictory, but internally, the country is “generally politically stable” in spite of everything.
      “Russia needs to understand that the Western model for society works, and that Russia’s friends are in the West. The enemies are somewhere else.”
      “Is Russia different from what it was 19 years ago? Yes, and radically so.”
      “Does the EU’s human rights policy work? Not 100 per cent.”
      In Stubb’s opinion, the right time to talk to Russia or China about human rights is “every day”.
     
He feels that democracy and human rights can only be exported to the rest of the world through example.
      “The EU is the one that has exported its own societal model to the world through soft power. It is through example that Turkey is changing its form of society, not because we have forced it to do so at gunpoint. The same philosophy applies to Russia, although with a much longer time delay.”
     
On the question of NATO membership, Stubb, who is known to be pro-NATO, keeps to the official line. This government will not apply for NATO membership, discussions need to continue, greater consensus is needed, the decision will not be forced, Stubb says, repeating the familiar lines.
      Then some emotion rises to the surface: “NATO is simply one international organisation among others. It happens to have the same foundation of values as we do, and happens to have the same goals as we do.”
      “But these matters have also been discussed for so long with by people looking at matters through the glasses of the Cold War on, that it is difficult to change this atmosphere of debate. NATO is still seen as a big, bad American-led military organisation, although it is something completely different today.”
      Still, NATO is not a point of disagreement in the government. There are no disagreements with the President, or with other ministers.
      Relations within the foreign policy leadership are excellent, Stubb insists. He will not encroach on the turf of others.
     
Stubb has met two thirds of the world’s foreign ministers.
      “I believe that the voice of the small country of Finland will not be heard if we have a silent foreign minister. Finland’s voice will be heard - not by isolating ourselves, but rather by committing ourselves to international institutions.”
     
What is Stubb’s goal with all of this? Certainly not the Finnish Presidency, if his answer holds.
      “I think it would be better for me to concentrate on this foreign policy, either in Finland, or in some other international post.”
      “If I have any added value to offer this country, then I think that it can be found on the international side and in international duties. On domestic policy, I completely rely on other people.”
      “National politics is not my thing. International politics is.”
     
Stubb defines himself as an “international Finn”. Finland’s role in his career is so small, however, that it requires some testing.
      President Urho Kekkonen?
      “Sitting in the post of Foreign Minister today, looking at documentary programmes about the last years of Kekkonen, or the way that the government approaches him with bouquets of flowers to ask him to accept another term, and he says ‘here I stand, as I can do nothing else, I have not asked for another term...’ it leaves me with a feeling, as it were, that there’s a time and a place for everything”, Stubb sighs.
      “I am happy to praise Kekkonen and Paasikivi, and give them credit for the fact that in addition to Norway, Finland was the only democracy to have a border with the Soviet Union throughout the Cold War.”
      Marshal C.G. Mannerheim?
      “One of my role models, an international Finn, a true cosmopolitan, and one of the central figures of Finnish independence. Mannerheim saved democracy and freedom, especially during the Winter and Continuation War”.
      “Mannerheim would undoubtedly be a federalist today. Naturally he was primarily a Finnish patriot, as we all are, but he was also ready for international interaction, and to defend his country.”
      “Mannerheim would have been, and still is a strong, great European. I don’t know if he would have been an international liberal, perhaps more an international conservative.”
     
Helsingin Sanomat / First published in print 25.10.2009


Previously in HS International Edition:
  Stubb on Afghanistan: “We are all on the same football team” (9.9.2009)
  Foreign Minister Stubb apologises for gaffe on destroyed Gaza clinic (14.8.2009)
  Stubb and Clinton discuss Russia and EU at meeting in Washington (12.5.2009)
  Foreign Minister Stubb apologises to Finnish peacekeepers (26.10.2009)
  Stubb to Lavrov: “Finland is not neutral” (10.11.2008)